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Sounds like a good bang for your buck! I know you have the BMC filter. Did you open the air box any? I thought I saw in an earlier post that you had?
 
Discussion starter · #62 ·
Sounds like a good bang for your buck! I know you have the BMC filter. Did you open the air box any? I thought I saw in an earlier post that you had?

My earlier "experiments" had me opening the airbox - in addition to using the BMC race filter, while having the baffle in the exhaust removed. This produced the largest gains, but at the expense of a tremendously loud bike. Too loud for casual use.

I then reverted to refitting the baffle, and doing so made the airbox mod and use of race filter unnecessary.

My final setup is no airbox mods, BMC (non-race) filter, baffled exhaust and disabling of the O2 system.

This is where it will stay for me, tuning is over and my fueling is **** near pefect.

On to other areas that need addressing...




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Soo remapping is necessary With aftermarket exhaust. Im thinking Project Italy CR-T or competitionWerkes Slip-on.

Is this easy to do yourself or something you should have Your dealer carry through?
I have never done soo before myself
 
Soo remapping is necessary With aftermarket exhaust. Im thinking Project Italy CR-T or competitionWerkes Slip-on.

Is this easy to do yourself or something you should have Your dealer carry through?
I have never done soo before myself
I have never had an ECU mapped either but it is very very simple with the Rexxer unit. Mine is in the post as we speak :)
 
Very anxious to hear what you guys have to say about the standard rexxer map. Please share when you can!
Not standard but custom based on the standard map they have and adjusted to on your mods.

Someone on another forum has the standard map from rexxer and they are very impressed
 
Anyone tried the remapped ECU with Rexxer mapping yet? I am quite tempted to use this service as the nearest Rexxer point is quite far away and they need to keep the bike for a week so that means two trips. I have been reading positive reviews on the Rexxer mapping and with a different slipon but std headers I think the bike should run well on their mapping for this configuration.
 
Anyone tried the remapped ECU with Rexxer mapping yet? I am quite tempted to use this service as the nearest Rexxer point is quite far away and they need to keep the bike for a week so that means two trips. I have been reading positive reviews on the Rexxer mapping and with a different slipon but std headers I think the bike should run well on their mapping for this configuration.
It is a very impressive mod. I ended up using the map I had made for a slip on, BMC standard filter, CAT eliminated and 02 sensors disabled. Transforms the bike in terms of smoothness and a very noticeable gain in power too :)
 
That would be my exact setup too, Tony! Good to hear that you like it. If I understand correctly by disabling the O2 sensors you run on the mapping all the time, whereas the O2 sensors enabled keeps the closed loop circuit in which the ECU will try to improve (or lean out) the mixture based on the input of the seonsors, which would likely mean that with a good map you would be better off running the O2 sensors disabled so that the mapping is correct all the time.
 
Discussion starter · #72 ·
That would be my exact setup too, Tony! Good to hear that you like it. If I understand correctly by disabling the O2 sensors you run on the mapping all the time, whereas the O2 sensors enabled keeps the closed loop circuit in which the ECU will try to improve (or lean out) the mixture based on the input of the seonsors, which would likely mean that with a good map you would be better off running the O2 sensors disabled so that the mapping is correct all the time.

This is correct.


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I wonder if the Termi Race map disables the O2 sensor and if not, why.

Also instead of disabling the O2 sensor, wouldn't it be better to adjust the parameters of the formula that the ECU uses when calculating the fuel mix it wants depending on the sensor input? Is the O2 system only there for emissions regulations or does it prevent the engine from running rich/lean because of changes in atmospheric pressure, air filter performance etc?

I still felt that I didn't understand this whole rich/lean and O2 sensor thing so I read up on it and from what I understand, the point of the O2 sensor is to get as close as possible to a 14.7:1 ratio regarding air to fuel. This is because at that ratio the catlytic converter works best. A rich or lean mix both result in increased emissions. So it seems that a bike running in the closed loop, using the oxygen sensor data, having a cat, will try to not run lean (or rich). It tries to hit the sweet spot in terms of cat efficiency.

Therefor disabling the O2 sensor can result in running lean or rich, depending on the fuel map in use.

But I think the real kicker is that eliminating the cat will **** up the formula that the ECU uses when calculating the fuel/air mix to use since without cat, the amount of O2 in the exhaust gases will be very different. The ECU will think the mix is too lean/rich and adjust accordingly even if the combustion is fine. Basically it just gets confused because it assumes the cat is still there.


So what I learn from these thoughts is that eliminating the cat but not the O2 sensor can be really bad. But eliminating the sensor too doesn't make it perfect either. Because now the ECU doesn't have enough data to adjust the fueling according to the atmospheric pressure and so on. A fuel map can't be perfect for all circumstances. Ideally the ECU would be made aware of the missing cat and adjust how it reacts to oxygen sensor data.

Now I think having an aftermarket exhaust with cat (remus, akrapovic) but removable baffles plus new fuel map but leaving O2 sensor intact is way better in terms of improving sound while keeping the engine healthy.

Please feel free to correct me if any of the above is wrong. I am a complete novice when it comes to these things.
 
I think it makes sense but I am by no means an expert. As I replaced my exhaust by a slipon without cat I think there is no need for the O2 sensors; indeed this means that the mapping will determine fuel mixture all the time, but I think this is not bad as the closed loop is only in effect for a small part of the running anyways. The mapping made by Rexxer should be better for all circumstances than the stock mapping with a different slipon/no cat. There will be differences between running at sea level and in the mountains, but that would be the case with the standard mapping and closed loop system in place too, as the closed loop does only work in limited circumstances.
 
It would be interesting to hear what mpg s you guys get with the remaps and setups you made. While I'd love a better throttle response, I'm not sure I'd give up 10 mpg for it. Thinking about it, ideal would be for the ecu to have two maps, one the one we have for distance either off-road or in the middle of nowhere, the other for weekends and around town. Just a pipe dream, I know.
 
It would be interesting to hear what mpg s you guys get with the remaps and setups you made. While I'd love a better throttle response, I'm not sure I'd give up 10 mpg for it. Thinking about it, ideal would be for the ecu to have two maps, one the one we have for distance either off-road or in the middle of nowhere, the other for weekends and around town. Just a pipe dream, I know.
A lot of Ducati's do have selectable maps. It would be cool to have that option on the Scrambler.

I remember reading a post Tony made on one of the forums indicating he lost only a couple MPG's. 10 would be way too much, but 2? I could handle that.
 
Yeah, I'd go for that. The wake-up call was in the middle of Nevada. I had driven about 60mi and the sign said next gas 110mi. Perfect would be a better map and a 5gal tank
 
A lot of Ducati's do have selectable maps. It would be cool to have that option on the Scrambler.

I remember reading a post Tony made on one of the forums indicating he lost only a couple MPG's. 10 would be way too much, but 2? I could handle that.
Tony Juliano has said in the past that working out what the difference is in mpg is a fair indication of what HP increase the map has given you. I should be able to get out on bike tomorrow and see what mpg is for my last full tank which has been run with my rexxer map that disables the 02 sensors so will report back then. I am expecting around a 6%ish loss in mpg to reflect a 6%ish gain in hp.
 
Hey tony, very informative thread! Thanks for posting all this info.

Noob question: is that the cat on the stock icon exhaust attached to the muffler and not part of the header? The reason why I ask is I don't see the cat in the pictures (don't have my bike yet) and I plan on only getting a slip on competition werkes exhaust, bmc air filter, and rexxer user unit as fat as performance mods go. Trying to find out if I have to swap out the header as well to eliminate the cat.

Thanks!


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